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Basketball Shot Clock approved for Class B boys and girls, other NSAA notes.

The proposal is similar to the Class A proposal in that if a visiting team from Class C1, C2, D1 or D2 plays at a Class B school.....that visiting school will decide if the game will be played with a shot clock or not.
 
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I like the move it a step in the right direction. Now they need to ban zone defenses!!! Allow kids to play the game rather than a spot on the court
 
- The NSAA board today also voted unanimously to keep the State Basketball Tournaments in Lincoln for another five years. (No other city submitted a bid.)

- The Board voted 6-2 in favor of a transfer eligibility change. It reads:

If a transfer student who did not meet the May 1 deadline, is enrolled at the school they transferred to on the first day of classes, that student would be immediately eligible on the last day of the moratorium. After 90 school days or if a student begins the school year at his/her school that they transferred to and did not meet the May 1st deadline, that the student would be immediately eligible after the 1st semester or last day of the moratorium.
Basically, if you miss the May 1 deadline, you will be eligible for holiday tournaments in basketball because the moratorium will have passed.

- The Board also voted unanimously to approve an action item allowing a few more Week Zero games in 2023 in football. Lincoln Standing Bear will not play a varsity football schedule in 2023, though they were part of the two-year scheduling cycle a year ago. That leaves a handful of schools seeking replacement games. The NSAA approved several Week Zero games to accommodate those Standing Bear opponents who lost a game. Those games will be:

Elkhorn North vs. Beatrice​
Blair vs. Norris​
Lincoln Northwest vs. Lincoln Pius X​
Omaha Westview vs. Crete​
 
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Some more notes from the meeting yesterday:

- Lincoln will increase its payments to the NSAA by $20,000 to $105,000 for hosting the state basketball tournaments. This is mostly due to the addition of the extra day of both tournaments, and comes to covering the rental fees for Pinnacle Bank Arena and the Devaney Center.

- Home field advantage for the high seed throughout the football playoffs has been added to Class C2

- Schools will now be allowed to schedule replacement football games, even after the season begins, if one of their opponents forfeits its remaining games

- Girls wrestling will stay at one class for next season and thus, no changes will be made to the state tournament format or schedule from the prior year. It has been proposed to possibly add a "subdistrict" round for girls wrestling.

- I haven't seen the language on it yet, but it was approved that schools that forfeit football games will now also take a point reduction/penalty as well
 
From the NSAA facebook page, highlights from the Representative Assembly

- The Representative Assembly voted 48-4 FOR adding a 7th quarter for basketball non-varsity and varsity competition days

- Voted 27-25 AGAINST allowing outside participation in boys and girls bowling

- Voted 51-1 FOR limiting softball dates to 18 dates

- Voted 35-17 FOR allowing triple entries in speech for Class A, B, C1 and C2

- Voted 49-3 FOR limiting participation in interschool track & field competitions by any school student to 12 total meets
 
From the NSAA facebook page, highlights from the Representative Assembly

- The Representative Assembly voted 48-4 FOR adding a 7th quarter for basketball non-varsity and varsity competition days

- Voted 27-25 AGAINST allowing outside participation in boys and girls bowling

- Voted 51-1 FOR limiting softball dates to 18 dates

- Voted 35-17 FOR allowing triple entries in speech for Class A, B, C1 and C2

- Voted 49-3 FOR limiting participation in interschool track & field competitions by any school student to 12 total meets
Is the current limit on track meets nine? That seems like a big jump. I know a lot of schools have a hard time fine subs, especially in the spring. Can’t imagine this would help that, assuming it gets approved by the NSAA and schools actually schedule that many meets.
 
Is the current limit on track meets nine? That seems like a big jump. I know a lot of schools have a hard time fine subs, especially in the spring. Can’t imagine this would help that, assuming it gets approved by the NSAA and schools actually schedule that many meets.
Yes, the current limit is nine meets involving four or more teams, excluding district and state competition.
 
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Yes, the current limit is nine meets involving four or more teams, excluding district and state competition.
In discussing with an AD buddy:

The Current Invite "major" limit is 9, and meet limit is 12. Meets with 3 or less teams are currently "minor" meets.

This change is being made to make things easier across the board. Right now teams have an invite canceled, and they may look to get into another meet. If that meet is is a triangular, there are times they can't get in because a 4th team makes it a "major" meet and one of the schools may not be able to allow the team trying to get in into the meet because it'd put them over the limit of 9 majors. This change will mean that all teams can be in 12 total meets regardless of size.
 
In discussing with an AD buddy:

The Current Invite "major" limit is 9, and meet limit is 12. Meets with 3 or less teams are currently "minor" meets.

This change is being made to make things easier across the board. Right now teams have an invite canceled, and they may look to get into another meet. If that meet is is a triangular, there are times they can't get in because a 4th team makes it a "major" meet and one of the schools may not be able to allow the team trying to get in into the meet because it'd put them over the limit of 9 majors. This change will mean that all teams can be in 12 total meets regardless of size.
Thanks for the explanation
 
Seems like the NSAA actually made a bunch of logical decisions this cycle
Just to throw another reminder out there, the Representative Assembly (and therefore all these logical decisions you’re in favor of) is made up of school personnel from NSAA member schools, not NSAA staff. It’s similar in some ways to our government set up. The legislative branch (member schools via Representative Assembly) make the rules, the executive branch (NSAA staff) enforce them.
 
Just to throw another reminder out there, the Representative Assembly (and therefore all these logical decisions you’re in favor of) is made up of school personnel from NSAA member schools, not NSAA staff. It’s similar in some ways to our government set up. The legislative branch (member schools via Representative Assembly) make the rules, the executive branch (NSAA staff) enforce them.
Did not know that, thanks for the info. Some logical representatives on it right now then
 
Did not know that, thanks for the info. Some logical representatives on it right now then
Rep assembly members also almost always vote as the member schools representatives did in the meetings where each member school in the NSAA district voted on the proposal.
 
A synopsis of the items approved by the Representative Assembly:

BOYS BASKETBALL / GIRLS BASKETBALL
Adding a 7th Quarter for non-varsity and varsity competition days

Author: Chad Cattau, Cedar Catholic High School

Summary: This proposal would allow basketball players to participate in 7 quarters when a school is playing a non-varsity game and a varsity game on the same evening.

Rationale: This proposal would help our non-varsity teams play four quarter games in basketball. There are many teams that don't have enough participants to play full non-varsity games, and this would allow an extra quarter for their players. This would help in the development of players, and it would help teams that have a large number of players more playing time because their non-varsity games can be expanded by one quarter. Many times, teams have 15 kids on their JV teams and they only get two or three quarters to get them all into the game so this would help the development of teams with smaller numbers and also teams with larger numbers of participants.

Pros: More playing time and development for our basketball players.

Cons: N/A

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BOYS BOWLING / GIRLS BOWLING
Outside participation in Boys/Girls Bowling

Author:
Mike Greene-Walsh, Omaha South

Summary: CURRENT: Any student who participates in any athletic contest other than as a representative of his/her high school during the season of the sport involved becomes ineligible to represent his/her school in that sport for one or more contests or the remainder of the season. CHANGE: And new subpoint to 3.5.1 to allow Bowling to be exempt from the Outside Participation penalty during the season of the sport. Duing the school sport season of bowling, a student may, after fulfilling all requirements, practices and competitions of the school bowling team, practice and/or compete as a member of a non-school bowling team or as an individual participant in an organized non-school bowling practice or competition under the conditions listed below. A) Priority shall be given to all school team practices and competition. Should a non-school practice/competition be in direct conflict with the school scheduled practice/competition, the school practice/competition shall take priority. Prior approval by the school administrator may grant an exception to a student to participate in the non-school bowling program if in direct conflict with the school program. B) No school time shall be missed to compete, practice or travel to the site of such non-school bowling competition unless the absence is approved in advance by the school administrator. C) A school shall not replace its bowling program with any non-school bowling program.

Rationale: Currently, bowlers make a choice to represent and compete for their school in the sport of bowling or to participate in Sunday and Holiday regional and national tournaments for SMART scholarship funds, as well as their youth leagues. This change makes the school program the primary program of the sport and the tournaments and the leagues the secondary program of the sport during the high school season. This sub-point parallels the provision given to Swimming and Diving for in-season outside participation.

Pros: In-season outside participation brings more student-athletes into high school bowling that would only participate in tournament and/or league bowling only. In-season outside competition teaches student-athletes the benefits of competition beyond the high school setting. In-season outside participation allows the student/athlete to gain technique and instruction from other coaches that teach in the youth bowling league setting. In-season outside participation gives the student-athlete the opportunity to compete and learn in challenging venues and conditions that would not normally be available in a high school bowling competition. In-season outside participation gives the student-athlete added exposure to college programs and coaches by participating in outside tournaments. The school is not responsible for any outside expenses accrued by the student-athlete while participating in the events outside of the school-sponsored activity.

Cons: Student athletes may compete in the same venue twice in one day: i.e. youth league in the morning and a high school competition in the afternoon.
 
SOFTBALL
Softball Dates Limitation

Authors:
David Davis, Fairbury | Ryun Theobald, Fillmore Central | Dallas Sweet, Malcolm

Summary: No team representing a member school in Class A, B or C may participate in more than eighteen (18) dates. The district and state championships are not included in the eighteen dates. A tournament is one date. Schools are limited to five (5) tournaments, including the conference tournament, during the regular season.

Rationale: Following the Class B Caucus proposal, we feel it is important to have Class B and C on the same number of dates, as there are a few schools that bounce up or down every year, and Class C having one less date could make for a scheduling nightmare.

Pros: Every class will have the same number of dates for competition.

Cons: Class B and C teams may incur a bit more expense and missed class time going from 17 dates to 18 dates.

=======================================

BOYS TRACK & FIELD / GIRLS TRACK & FIELD
Participation in interschool track and field competition

Author:
Jason Polk, Wisner-Pilger

Summary: Participation in interschool track and field competitions by any school student shall be limited to twelve (12) total meets. This would not include district or state competition.

Rationale: In the spring, the weather is unpredictable. Lately, many early season duals and triangulars have been cancelled and not rescheduled. Teams cannot find other meets to join because if a school allowed them to join their triangular, for example, it would then be considered a meet of four or more teams and count against their limit. Currently, teams can have an unlimited number of smaller meets of less than three teams. This proposal would limit the total number of meets to twelve (12) but provides flexibility for schools and does not cost the schools or NSAA any additional money. Teams could keep their current schedule under this proposal and make no changes.

Pros: 1) Provide more flexibility in scheduling and making up cancelled track meets. 2) Athletes invited to and participating in all-star meets gain flexibility in the selection of meets they can compete in.

Cons: N/A
 
SPEECH
Allow Triple Entry in Class A though C2 (Already Allowed in D1 and D2)

Author:
Ernie Valentine, Jarod Ockander, A.J. Johnson & the Nebraska Speech Communication and Theatre Association

Summary: Competitors in Class D1 and D2 can triple-enter currently. This proposal would allow competitors in all classes to triple-enter.

Rationale: There are teams in every class that are small enough that they do not have a "full" district entry, and when enough teams are not full, then district tournaments are not as competitive. Almost always, at most only three or four teams in each district of seven to nine teams had a "full" or complete entry. Allowing individuals to triple-enter will make it easier for more teams to bring a full entry.

In 2021, any given speech district tournament in Classes A through C2, there were between 7 and 9 teams. Almost always, only three or four teams in each district had a "full" or complete entry. And of the 22 district tournaments in 2021 in Classes A through C2 (the classes that do not have triple entry), there were only 9 district tournaments that were 70% capacity or higher for entries. The range was 88% capacity for the highest district (B-3) to 39.5% for the lowest capacity district (C2-1).

Regular season tournaments often offer triple-entry, so there are already students who are prepared to compete in three events at districts. On teams that triple-enter during the regular season, there are individuals who would qualify for three district spots, and coaches must choose which two events to use the individuals in. The rule change would allow coaches to make the decision to use an individual in three events, if desired.

Class D1 and D2 have been using triple-entry since the 2019 season. In that time, about half of the schools used triple-entry at districts at any point in that three-year span (55 of approximately 120), and of those, only 31 schools used triple-entry more than one time in the same period. The percent of individual team members who were triple-entered at districts was 5.65% in 2019, 10.19% in 2021 (the first year after COVID) and 7.07% last year.

This proposal originated with the Nebraska Speech Communication and Theatre Association, where member coaches voted to advance this proposal. This is the second year a clear majority of coaches at the NSCTA Convention voted to advance.

Pros: Allowing a triple entry will lead to larger team entries, resulting in more competitive district tournaments in all classes, as well as having the best competitors in any given event.

Cons: It is possible that the coach of a team that has a "full" or complete entry may choose to use a triple entered student on a coach decision, replacing someone who might not get the chance to compete at districts. This could result in fewer competitors from that team qualifying for the state tournament. Additionally, the number of students on each team who can handle being triple-entered on a high enough level to make the district team in all three events on a large team is small enough the overall effect of this aspect would be small. One could also argue that the best student in each event within that team should get the chance to compete for a state championship, even if they are triple-entered. The overall effect of the proposal will fill the entry capacity of each district, increasing competition.
 
The NSAA Board of Directors met on April 13, 2023 at the NSAA Office in Lincoln with the following members present:

District I - Kara Graham, Lincoln Southeast​
District I - Dr. Dana Wiseman, Sutton​
District II - Dr. Nick Wemhoff, Fort Calhoun​
District II - Thomas Lee, Omaha Westview​
District III - Dr. Jon Cerny, Bancroft-Rosalie​
District IV - Ryan Ruhl, Centura​
District V - Robert Drews, Alliance​
District VI - Dr. Troy Unzicker, Alliance​
Also in attendance were: Bobby Truhe, NSAA Legal Counsel; Kim Snyder, Nebraska Department of Education liaison; Jeff Maul and Derek Bombeck, Visit Lincoln; Tim Savona, Pinnacle Bank Arena; Matt Davidson, University of Nebraska-Lincoln; Derek Bond, University of Nebraska-Lincoln; and Dr. JJ Toczek, Lincoln Public Schools.

The meeting was called to order at 8:34 a.m.

1. It was moved to approve the Consent Agenda as presented. Items on the Consent Agenda included:

- approval of the meeting Agenda as amended​
- approval of the Minutes of the March 8, 2023 Board of Directors meeting​
- approval of the Minutes of the March 15, 2023 Classification Committee meeting​
- approval of the Financial Statements​
- approval of the following cooperative sponsorship renewals for the 2023-24 and 2024-25 schools years:​
- Papillion-LaVista and Papillion-LaVista South for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- McCook, Medicine Valley and Southwest for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- Cross County and Osceola for Wrestling​
- North Platte and Ogallala for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- Sargent and Loup County for Wrestling, Boys Basketball and Girls Basketball​
- Ralston and Omaha Gross for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- Hastings, Adams Central and Hastings St. Cecilia for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- Bellevue East and Platteview for Boys Swimming and Girls Swimming​
- Omaha Skutt and Elkhorn Mt. Michael for Boys Swimming​
- approval of the dissolution of the following cooperative sponsorship for the 2023-24 school year:​
- Lawrence-Nelson and Sandy Creek for Boys Cross Country, Girls Cross Country and Wrestling​
Motion Carried: 8-0

2. Moved to consider all NSAA Approval Ruling proposals: Motion Carried: 8-0

  1. Basketball: Class B Shot Clock. Motion Carried: 7-1 (Against: Drews)

  2. Bowling - District Tournament Format. Motion Carried: 8-0

  3. Cross Country - Class B Districts qualify first 30 runners, team 4 runners, runners finishing lower than 6th may only qualify for state as an individual. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Cerny, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Drews)

  4. Cross Country - Class B Districts qualify first 30 runners, team 4 runners, runners finishing lower than 3rd may only qualify for state as an individual. Motion Failed: 0-8

  5. Classification - Class A combined enrollment of 1,000 and above. Motion Failed: 2-6 (For: Wemhoff, Cerny | Against: Graham, Wiseman, Lee, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker)

  6. Classification - Class A combined enrollment of 900 and above. Motion Failed: 3-5 (For: Wiseman, Wemhoff, Unzicker | Against: Graham, Lee, Cerny, Ruhl, Drews)

  7. Football - 8-man eligibility number of 51. Motion Failed: 3-5 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Cerny | Against: Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker)

  8. Football - 8-man eligibility number of 55. Motion Failed: 2-6 (For: Wemhoff, Cerny | Against: Graham, Wiseman, Lee, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker)

  9. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 500 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally. Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Cerny)

  10. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 450 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Unzicker)

  11. Football - Class C2 highest seed hosts throughout the playoffs. Motion Carried: 8-0

  12. Football - 6-man highest seed hosts throughout the playoffs. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Cerny, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Wiseman, Lee, Ruhl)

  13. Fotball - 8-man and 6-man running clock. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Lee, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Cerny, Ruhl, Drews)

  14. Penalties - Remove $200 assessment for not opting out of the postseason. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Cerny, Ruhl)

  15. Golf - Removal of Class A state scoring monitors. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee | Against: Cerny, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker)

  16. College Camps/Clinics - During the season of a sport students are permitted to attend and take part in college camps/clinics. Motion Carried: 5-3 (For: Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Unzicker | Against: Garham, Cerny, Drews)

  17. Journalism - Adding judge critiques to the state contest. Motion Carried: 8-0
 
  1. Journalism - A complete list of judges will be provided to the participating schools. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Cerny, Ruhl)

  2. Journalism - Two judges will be used at the state competition. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Unzicker | Against: Cerny, Drews)

  3. Play Production - Districts will utilize one judge for technical award. Motion Carried: 5-3 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl | Against: Cerny, Drews, Unzicker)

  4. Play Production - District Technical Award winner will receive a plaque. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Drews | Against: Cerny, Unzicker)

  5. Play Production - Districts will award one outstanding female performer and one outstanding male performer. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Unzicker | Against: Cerny, Drews)

  6. Play Production - Districts will award two outstanding performers. Motion Failed: 2-6 (For: Cerny, Drews | Against: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Unzicker)

  7. Replacement Games - When a team cancels/forfeits its season, affected teams may replace the forfeited contest. Motion Carried: 7-1 (Against: Cerny)

  8. Speech - OID's use of staging devices is limited to boxes, stools or chairs. Motion Carried: 8-0

  9. Tennis - Increase play date limit to 18. Motion Carried: 7-1 (Against: Cerny)

  10. Tennis - A maximum of two coaches are permitted to coach at duals and invites. Motion Carried: 8-0

  11. Track & Field - Eliminate the prelims in the 300m hurdles and 400m dash at the state championships. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Graham, Wiseman, Cerny, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Lee)

  12. Track & Field - Eliminate the prelims in the 300m hurdles and 400m dash and add three relays (800 meter relay, 800 meter sprint medley relay and 1600 meter distance medley relay). Motion Failed: 2-6 (For: Cerny, Unzicker | Against: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Drews)

  13. Track & Field - A tie for the last qualifying spot in all running events and relays will be broken by using the FAT time to the thousandth place. If a tie still remains the school name will be used. Motion Failed: 2-6 (For: Cerny, Ruhl | Against: Graham, Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Drews, Unzicker)

  14. Track & Field - A tie for the last qualifying spot in all running events and relays will be broken using the FAT results beyond the hundredths. Motion Carried: 8-0

  15. Transfer Eligibility - Students who did not meet the May 1st transfer deadline and enroll at the school they transferred to on the first day of classes would be immediately eligible on the last day of the moratorium or after the first semester ends. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Wiseman, Wemhoff, Lee, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Graham, Cerny)

  16. Volleyball - Out-of-state tournaments played to 21 points will count in wildcard standings. Motion Carried: 8-0

  17. Wrestling - State Championship seeding separating district champions. Motion Carried: 6-2 (For: Wemhoff, Lee, Cerny, Ruhl, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Graham, Wiseman)
3. The Board Summer Retreat will be held June 14-15 in Kearney.

4. The Board was provided a progress update on the UNL Raikes Design Studio's reconstruction of the NSAA's website.

5. The Board heard a presentation from Lincoln for the NSAA Girls and Boys State Basketball Championship.

6. Moved to award the NSAA Girls and Boys State Basketball Championship to Lincoln for the 2024 through 2028 seasons. Motion Carried: 8-0

7. Moved to adopt the following football language beginning with the 2023 season:

(1) Any school that forfeits a regular season contest will be ineligible for the postseason. (2) Any school that forfeits a regular season or postseason contest will be fined $1,000 with the money going to the opponent if the game was to be the opponent's home game. The fine will be waived if the NSAA is able to replace the opponent's home game. (3) Any school that forfeits a regular season or postseason contest will be responsible for paying the officials.
Motion Carried: 8-0

8. Moved to permit Class B Girls and Boys Basketball to use the shot clock beginning with the 2023-24 season. Motion Carried: 8-0

9. The Board discussed ways to support diversity, equity and inclusion.

10. Moved to permit the following schools to begin football practice one week early and play in Week 0: Elkhorn North, Beatrice, Blair, Norris, Lincoln Northwest, Lincoln Pius X, Omaha Westview and Crete. Additionally, the NSAA staff may permit other schools the ability to practice early and lay week zero contests if the need arises. Motion Carried: 8-0

11. The Board heard a presentation from Raymond James Financial.

There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 12:38 p.m.

The next meeting of the NSAA Board of Directors will be May 19, 2023 at the Embassy Suites in LaVista.
 
  1. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 500 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally. Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Cerny)
  2. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 450 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Unzicker)

    Am I the only person who thinks Class A needs to smaller, not larger? Class A should be 590 and above. (Or cap it at 24 teams). Fremont, Bell East, Norfolk, Columbus, NP and South Sioux do not need to be in Class A.



  3. Football - 6-man highest seed hosts throughout the playoffs. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Cerny, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Wiseman, Lee, Ruhl)

    I wished this would have passed. Maybe the next go around. All high seeds should host in the playoffs.
 
  1. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 500 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally. Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Cerny)
  2. Football - 11-man classification numbers: Class A 450 and above, Class B 499-200, Class C1 and C2 199 and below divided equally Motion Failed: 1-7 (For: Unzicker)

    Am I the only person who thinks Class A needs to smaller, not larger? Class A should be 590 and above. (Or cap it at 24 teams). Fremont, Bell East, Norfolk, Columbus, NP and South Sioux do not need to be in Class A.



  3. Football - 6-man highest seed hosts throughout the playoffs. Motion Failed: 4-4 (For: Graham, Cerny, Drews, Unzicker | Against: Wemhoff, Wiseman, Lee, Ruhl)

    I wished this would have passed. Maybe the next go around. All high seeds should host in the playoffs.
Won't work that way though. Many of the schools you list have a hard time seeing themselves as a Class B school...

Really wish they'd address the 8 man number, everything keeps getting voted down, but we see more and more forfeits all the time in C2 and below. I would think addressing the number would maybe help schools become more comfortable with moving to 8 man.
 
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Won't work that way though. Many of the schools you list have a hard time seeing themselves as a Class B school...

Really wish they'd address the 8 man number, everything keeps getting voted down, but we see more and more forfeits all the time in C2 and below. I would think addressing the number would maybe help schools become more comfortable with moving to 8 man.
They need to address the 8 man number, agreed. It's not popular, but I bet if there was a class of 9 man, you'd see some of the C2 schools drop down. Field stays the same. Gameplan doesn't change so drastically.
 
45 and under should be class D. 46-60 should be 9 man. 61-90 should be C-2.

9 man would lead to a lot more sports co-ops I think
Absolutely don't want another class in football, but 9 man is more and more intriguing to me all the time. I'm not sure how the member schools would work the numbers game to have an 8 man class, 9 man class, and then 11 man classes.
 
I mean. I guess we can reignite this. But it's not going to stop schools like Wakefield opting down to kick the **** out of smaller schools (48-32 over the last 10 years, with a 7-0, 7-1, 6-2, 7-1, and 7-2 season in there, all opted down), and most other schools that opt down will still struggle immensely whether they are in class A or class D. So, problems will exist literally no matter what.
 
I mean. I guess we can reignite this. But it's not going to stop schools like Wakefield opting down to kick the **** out of smaller schools (48-32 over the last 10 years, with a 7-0, 7-1, 6-2, 7-1, and 7-2 season in there, all opted down), and most other schools that opt down will still struggle immensely whether they are in class A or class D. So, problems will exist literally no matter what.
I think if you made three classes of 11 man, a class of 9, a class of 8 and a class of 6, opting down would not be allowed at the varsity level. I don't think it should be allowed now personally.

If a school wants to opt down, play a schedule with only teams that opt down or a jv schedule. It's just not that difficult.
 
I agree with you. Doesn't mean the manipulators wouldn't be out in force to try to get an advantage. I'm just not sure who 9 man (or an additional class in general) helps.
 
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Won't work that way though. Many of the schools you list have a hard time seeing themselves as a Class B school...

Really wish they'd address the 8 man number, everything keeps getting voted down, but we see more and more forfeits all the time in C2 and below. I would think addressing the number would maybe help schools become more comfortable with moving to 8 man.
Disagree. This does not make football better. The number is high enough. Too many teams opting down that can easily play 11 man. If you cant field a team its not the other 40 schools’ problem.
 
Disagree. This does not make football better. The number is high enough. Too many teams opting down that can easily play 11 man. If you cant field a team its not the other 40 schools’ problem.
You can disagree all you want. Fact is Nebraska has the lowest 8 man number in the nation of states that support 8 man.

You chose to focus on the teams you feel are a bully for opting down. Looking at opt downs very very few actually win a lot. I choose to look at teams that forfeit as hurting the kids on the team they were supposed to play, and robbing them of 1 of the 27 (36 if they’re lucky enough to play as a freshman) opportunities to play football that they were guaranteed!

To each their own…
 
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Weird, it's almost like the team that opts down to beat up on smaller schools ruins the entire concept of opting down for a lot of people. Strange how that works, huh?

Personally, I think a simple solution is that if you opt down for a 2 year cycle and are above .500, you need to opt back to your original class the next cycle. That way most programs that decide to opt down are fine (since most struggle no matter what class they are in) and can continue to develop their program and provide opportunities to schools, and the offender in this situation is held accountable.

For example, if you tell me Wakefield can be a winning program and beat the snot out of many teams in D1, but would forfeit games in C2, I'm going to call you a liar. They just like to win, and don't want to consider themselves losers if they only win a few games. It's that kind of community.
 
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Weird, it's almost like the team that opts down to beat up on smaller schools ruins the entire concept of opting down for a lot of people. Strange how that works, huh?

Personally, I think a simple solution is that if you opt down for a 2 year cycle and are above .500, you need to opt back to your original class the next cycle. That way most programs that decide to opt down are fine (since most struggle no matter what class they are in) and can continue to develop their program and provide opportunities to schools, and the offender in this situation is held accountable.

For example, if you tell me Wakefield can be a winning program and beat the snot out of many teams in D1, but would forfeit games in C2, I'm going to call you a liar. They just like to win, and don't want to consider themselves losers if they only win a few games. It's that kind of community.
I can live with your argument on not having the option to opt down if you are above .500 in a 2 year cycle in which you just opted down. That makes a lot of sense to me in a way.

I was in no way referring to Wakefield and saying they, or any of the other schools that opt down would be forfeiting in C2. Fact is there are teams in C2 that are and have forfeited for a number of years. I spent a lot of time paying attention to C1 and C2 football in NE Nebraska. Never saw a team forfeit and decide to opt down, let alone opt down to beat the snot out of people. Not sure why Wakefield opts down, and why so many people on here make them a poster child. I'm sure there is a history there, but last year Wakefield finished 4-4 with no wins over a .500 team and their largest victory over B-R...who should be looking in the mirror if they complain about not being good...seems to me that BRLD coop treated them well for a number of years...then someone took their ball and went home because of hurt feelings and it hurt the kids of that community.
 
I probably hammer the point too much about them. If you look at the stretch of teams they have had over the last 10 years of opting down/not being play off eligible, you'd understand. Their coach also is on this same forum moralizing often, while also bragging about how they have record breaking performances out of the best run of athletes they have had in a long time, to paraphrase his own words.

It comes across as very...I'm not sure the word. Slimy? Like he is dancing around just straight up saying that he and his community would rather opt down, run up the scores on smaller schools, not go to the playoffs, then complain that it's not their fault for opting down, it's everyone else's fault for having the 8 man number be too high.

Wakefield (and the coach himself) just gives the whole process of opting down a bad name. If a school like SSC opted down to class B, was .500 or above and gloated about it, then stayed there to keep on winning, I'd be just as vocal. They, in fact, the last few years, opted down to B, got to around .500, then went back to A. I feel like that should be the goal of the whole thing.
 
Wakefield opts down because they don't have the kids going out for football, no? It's not a matter of "wanting to beat on schools". The school has a Class C enrollment but not a Class C roster size.
 
Weird, it's almost like the team that opts down to beat up on smaller schools ruins the entire concept of opting down for a lot of people. Strange how that works, huh?

Personally, I think a simple solution is that if you opt down for a 2 year cycle and are above .500, you need to opt back to your original class the next cycle. That way most programs that decide to opt down are fine (since most struggle no matter what class they are in) and can continue to develop their program and provide opportunities to schools, and the offender in this situation is held accountable.

For example, if you tell me Wakefield can be a winning program and beat the snot out of many teams in D1, but would forfeit games in C2, I'm going to call you a liar. They just like to win, and don't want to consider themselves losers if they only win a few games. It's that kind of community.
I really think it needs enrollment moved to fifty and eliminate the opt down to 8-man option or at least give schools a choice to not play a team who opts down, and be sure you fill all teams schedule before you fill a team opting down BUT 50 is needed
 
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