Basketball New Basketball Postseason Needed

[Southernblood]

Clearly, due to costs and travel, the smaller schools cannot do a perfect serpentine like Class A does, but that doesn't mean we can't use a combination of schools earning a host site then filling in geographically.

The idea I would like to see used is that in classes C1-D2 the top 16 in Power Points by a certain date(this year Feb. 12 since subs begin Feb. 19) are designated as Sub-District/District/Regional hosts with the rest of the teams filled in by closest hosts, and yes some schools would have to travel past a host in order to fill in their district. Class B has 32 schools so just seed 1-32 and play it out from there.

For C2 boys, this would produce multiple hosts from 4 current subdistricts, including 3 from C2-4, C2-8, and C2-9. There would be 8 districts of 4 and 8 districts of 3.

If the postseason was decided today, it would look like this:

C2-1 @ Ponca
Ponca (20-1), 46.4762
Hartington Cedar Catholic
Hartington-Newcastle
Crofton

C2-2 @ Elmwood-Murdock
Elmwood-Murdock (16-2), 45.9444
Omaha Brownell-Talbott
Archbishop Bergan

C2-3 @ Arcadia-Loup City
Arcadia-Loup City (17-1), 45.8333
North Platte St. Patrick's
Maxwell
Burwell

C2-4 @ Yutan
Yutan (17-1), 45.7222
Howells-Dodge
Oakland-Craig

C2-5 @ South Loup
South Loup (16-1), 45.2941
Bayard
Bridgeport
Hemingford
Kimball

C2-6 @ Hastings St. Cecilia
Hastings St. Cecilia (16-3), 45.1579
Sandy Creek
Superior

C2-7 @ BRLD
BRLD (18-2), 44.9000
Omaha Nation
Homer

C2-8 @ Freeman
Freeman (16-5), 44.7143
Southern
Palmyra

C2-9 @ Ravenna
Ravenna (15-4), 44.5263
Southern Valley
Southwest
Cambridge

C2-10 @ Centennial
Centennial (18-2), 44.3000
Shelby-Rising City
Cross County

C2-11 @ Battle Creek
Battle Creek (14-5), 44.1053
Creighton
Neligh-Oakdale
Ainsworth

C2-12 @ Lutheran High Northeast
Lutheran High Northeast (14-4), 43.5556
Stanton
Twin River
Niobrara

C2-13 @ Doniphan-Trumbull
Doniphan-Trumbull (12-7), 43.3158
Amherst
Centura
Nebraska Christian

C2-14 @ Dundy County-Stratton
Dundy County-Stratton (15-5), 43.2500
Maxwell
Perkins County
Sutherland

C2-15 @ Wisner-Pilger
Wisner-Pilger (14-6), 43.2500
Wakefield
Laurel-Concord

C2-16 @ Sutton
Sutton (13-7), 43.2000
Thayer Central
Fillmore Central

District/Regional/Sub-State/Whatever Finals
C2-1 vs C2-16
C2-2 vs C2-15
C2-3 vs C2-14
C2-4 vs C2-13
C2-5 vs C2-12
C2-6 vs C2-11
C2-7 vs C2-10
C2-8 vs C2-9

 

[Southernblood]

Here is what the map would look like for C2.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1x21XvffAeUnR7lGz_94iwr_kJyUyKZOY&usp=sharing

 

[Kard4life]

I like this idea a lot!

Would you have the sub-State game ex. C2-1 winner vs C2-16 winner play at a neutral sight? Or at C2-1 winners home court?

Would you re-seed the state tournament based on power points once sub-state is played?

 

[Southernblood]

Although it says a team is the host, for example, in the western districts a neutral site could be used if agreed upon such as Ogallala to cut down overall travel. And yes, neutral site for the substate/district final type game for C2-1 vs C2-16, etc.

Depending on upsets and the top 8 at the end of the regular season not being the ones in Lincoln, then reseeding for the state tournament would almost have to be necessary.

 

[Southernblood]

Here is what it would look like if Subdistricts/Districts/Regionals were determined today for C2.

C2-1 @ Ponca
Ponca (23-1), 46.8750
Hartington Cedar Catholic
Hartington-Newcastle
Crofton

C2-2 @ Elmwood-Murdock
Elmwood-Murdock (17-2), 45.8421
Omaha Brownell-Talbott
Archbishop Bergan

C2-3 @ Yutan
Yutan (20-1), 45.5238
Howells-Dodge
Oakland-Craig

C2-4 @ Hastings St. Cecilia
Hastings St. Cecilia (18-3), 45.3810
Sandy Creek
Southern Valley
Superior

C2-5 @ BRLD
BRLD (20-2), 45.3182
Omaha Nation
Homer

C2-6 @ South Loup
South Loup (18-2), 44.8500
North Platte St. Patrick's
Sutherland
Maxwell

C2-7 @ Arcadia-Loup City
Arcadia-Loup City (19-3), 44.5909
Amherst
Burwell

C2-8 @ Freeman
Freeman (16-6), 44.5909
Southern
Palmyra

C2-9 @ Battle Creek
Battle Creek (17-5), 44.4545
Creighton
Neligh-Oakdale
Ainsworth

C2-10 @ Centennial
Centennial (19-3), 44.2273
Shelby-Rising City
Cross County

C2-11 @ Lutheran High Northeast
Lutheran High Northeast (16-4), 44.2000
Stanton
Twin River
Niobrara

C2-12 @ Ravenna
Ravenna (15-7), 43.6818
Centura
Doniphan-Trumbull
Nebraska Christian

C2-13 @ Sutton
Sutton (15-7), 43.2273
Thayer Central
Fillmore Central

C2-14 @ Dundy County-Stratton
Dundy County-Stratton (16-5), 43.1429
Southwest
Perkins County
Cambridge

C2-15 @ Wisner-Pilger
Wisner-Pilger (16-7), 43.1304
Wakefield
Laurel-Concord

C2-16 @ Bridgeport
Bridgeport (15-7), 42.9091
Hemingford
Kimball
Bayard

 

[Southernblood]

And here is the map.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=122ATUUdAYtm9BocQLIsoFLZ1ZmDqD-Ah&usp=sharing

 

[runningback43]

Why don't we do post season basketball like the playoffs in football. Top 16 teams in power points get in. Honestly, do teams with 2 or 3 wins get excited to be in sub districts, or are they just looking forward to the spring sports season?

 

[Southernblood]

Why don't we do post season basketball like the playoffs in football. Top 16 teams in power points get in. Honestly, do teams with 2 or 3 wins get excited to be in sub districts, or are they just looking forward to the spring sports season?

I would say 32, but I agree.

 

[runningback43]

I thought the same after I put 16 down. Let's go with 32 teams and call it good in each class. Play at the home site of the top seed or find a neutral site.

 

[trackman77]

Lets remember the whole general purpose of athletics. Its to learn about and teach life skills such as team work, dedication, hard work, dealing with adversity and above all learning to deal with both winning and losing.

It never has and I hope never will be just about who sets at the "top" of the mountain or who is at the bottom.
JMO

 

[Southernblood]

Lets remember the whole general purpose of athletics. Its to learn about and teach life skills such as team work, dedication, hard work, dealing with adversity and above all learning to deal with both winning and losing.

It never has and I hope never will be just about who sets at the "top" of the mountain or who is at the bottom.
JMO

I agree that the lessons are greater than the awards. I would counter though that the postseason, where lessons are still learned, is about crowning a champion and getting the best teams to the state tournament. That is where the geographically based subdistricts fail our young people.

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

I agree that the lessons are greater than the awards. I would counter though that the postseason, where lessons are still learned, is about crowning a champion and getting the best teams to the state tournament. That is where the geographically based subdistricts fail our young people.

agree

 

[trackman77]

Your key phrase was "a champion" which is accomplished under the current, the past or any future plans.

 

[Southernblood]

Your key phrase was "a champion" which is accomplished under the current, the past or any future plans.

You left out the second part of that sentence.

and getting the best teams to the state tournament.

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

You left out the second part of that sentence.

I can only guess that people who do not want a 32 team seeded tournament with nutueral sites first two round before you go to Lincoln, dont like it because they know the only chance for their team to go to State is end up with a weak district KINDA SAD but fits todays America, poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also

 

[runningback43]

I can only guess that people who do not want a 32 team seeded tournament with nutueral sites first two round before you go to Lincoln, dont like it because they know the only chance for their team to go to State is end up with a weak district KINDA SAD but fits todays America, poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also

I believe you hit the nail on the head

 

[just_average32]

I can only guess that people who do not want a 32 team seeded tournament with nutueral sites first two round before you go to Lincoln, dont like it because they know the only chance for their team to go to State is end up with a weak district KINDA SAD but fits todays America, poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also

Bingo.

 

[Southernblood]

I can only guess that people who do not want a 32 team seeded tournament with nutueral sites first two round before you go to Lincoln, dont like it because they know the only chance for their team to go to State is end up with a weak district KINDA SAD but fits todays America, poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also

I wouldn't say calling for fairness to be "poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also". Do you think the B1G basketball tournament should be set up based on geography first with no regard to team records? What about the NCAA tournament?

The people, like myself, calling for changes don't want everyone to get an award for participating but believe that the best teams should get to Lincoln. That doesn't always happen when certain subdistrict of 5 schools each season have 3 of the top 10 teams in the state. The entirely geography based postseason hurts what could be an even better product in Lincoln.

If the regular season doesn't matter then why not just start subdistricts in January so we can get to Track/Baseball/Golf sooner?

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

I wouldn't say calling for fairness to be "poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also". Do you think the B1G basketball tournament should be set up based on geography first with no regard to team records? What about the NCAA tournament?

The people, like myself, calling for changes don't want everyone to get an award for participating but believe that the best teams should get to Lincoln. That doesn't always happen when certain subdistrict of 5 schools each season have 3 of the top 10 teams in the state. The entirely geography based postseason hurts what could be an even better product in Lincoln.

If the regular season doesn't matter then why not just start subdistricts in January so we can get to Track/Baseball/Golf sooner?

Thats exactly what I am saying,, I agree, come on man read Seed it 32 teams and do away with outdated districts

 

[Southernblood]

Thats exactly what I am saying,, I agree, come on man read Seed it 32 teams and do away with outdated districts

Haha definitely missed the "not" part of your message. All good.

 

[huskerlandfan]

I think part of the issue with some of the smaller schools is that their gyms in some to a lot of cases aren't adequate size to host the types of crowds that sub-district/district games bring in. It would be hard for a lot of them to be a host without a neutral site.

 

[HighPlainsCoach]

I can only guess that people who do not want a 32 team seeded tournament with nutueral sites first two round before you go to Lincoln, dont like it because they know the only chance for their team to go to State is end up with a weak district KINDA SAD but fits todays America, poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also

That's pretty much nonsense. What YOU are championing is exactly what you are accusing those of us with common sense of doing. Because YOUR kid doesn't get a T shirt for losing in the first round, you, instead of doing what teams have always done, you know, WIN, start talking about getting screwed because your team is in the wrong region. The best 4 teams always make it to state, imo. The next 4? They need to steal a win from a superior team at some point. They've already had that chance. They failed. The "logic" of having a system that's bad for schools, bad for kids, and bad for families, just so two, maybe three teams can get T shirts for losing in Lincoln completely escapes me. Little Billy will be just fine being a Sub-District loser. I'm guessing it really won't affect his life much, one way or the other. In the meantime I'll wait for video review, a shot clock, 3 game series, and committee bracketing to ensure complete...."fairness". smh

 

[HighPlainsCoach]

I wouldn't say calling for fairness to be "poor me, give to me, I should get a ribbon also". Do you think the B1G basketball tournament should be set up based on geography first with no regard to team records? What about the NCAA tournament?

The people, like myself, calling for changes don't want everyone to get an award for participating but believe that the best teams should get to Lincoln. That doesn't always happen when certain subdistrict of 5 schools each season have 3 of the top 10 teams in the state. The entirely geography based postseason hurts what could be an even better product in Lincoln.

If the regular season doesn't matter then why not just start subdistricts in January so we can get to Track/Baseball/Golf sooner?

I would argue that the ONLY "fair" thing is that every team has a chance to win their way to State. This is a lot more about parent egos than anything. You tell kids: Do this and you get to state. They get it. Instead I hear parents talking about "fairness". "My kid didn't get a T shirt for losing to the same two teams that beat them all year!". Let's give real examples of teams that get screwed and we can discuss which of them "deserve" a state title! Or maybe people just want to play until their kids team wins?

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

That's pretty much nonsense. What YOU are championing is exactly what you are accusing those of us with common sense of doing. Because YOUR kid doesn't get a T shirt for losing in the first round, you, instead of doing what teams have always done, you know, WIN, start talking about getting screwed because your team is in the wrong region. The best 4 teams always make it to state, imo. The next 4? They need to steal a win from a superior team at some point. They've already had that chance. They failed. The "logic" of having a system that's bad for schools, bad for kids, and bad for families, just so two, maybe three teams can get T shirts for losing in Lincoln completely escapes me. Little Billy will be just fine being a Sub-District loser. I'm guessing it really won't affect his life much, one way or the other. In the meantime I'll wait for video review, a shot clock, 3 game series, and committee bracketing to ensure complete...."fairness". smh

And this is our new liberal love all poor me get ribbon for showing up world has produced SAD. SEED it 1 to 31 and you still can win in Just awards the better teams as it should

 

[Llama57]

Even if something as simple as still playing 12 Subdistricts, taking those winner, and then adding the next 4 highest in power points would be better. Then serpentine by power points, and winners go to state.
Class C1 would look something like this. (at least close, I took power points from today with sub-winners automatically getting in)
Wahoo VS Kearney Catholic
'Bago VS Ogallala
Broken Bow VS Mitchell
GICC VS Syracuse
LVSS VS Auburn
Lincoln Christian VS BCNG
O'Neill VS Cozad
North Bend VS Gordon Rushville

If there is a bunny bracket game in subs, play that on Saturday at the higher seed. Then subs at a neutral site on Monday/Tuesday, then Finals at a neutral site on the Saturday of the same week.

Seems like rocket science, but it shouldn't be that hard.

 

[ClkTwr2011]

I personally like the fact that all teams get a shot to win their way to Lincoln. However, I haven't really looked at the past history and looked to see if those near .500 teams that occasionally get there would have made the 16 or 32 team cut. The thing I have noticed with basketball is that a single early season (or late season for that matter) injury to a single player can really effect that team's record and therefore opportunity to possibly get to the State tournament. Football season hangover is another thing that can really hurt a basketball team early in the season.

I like the idea of assigning the districts late in the season. I know that it effects travel logistics and whatnot, but I like it. Additionally, in this format, I believe there should be 8 districts and no wildcards. I would just really like to see a situation in which the best 8 teams get to Lincoln. Plain and simple.

Either way, I won't lose any sleep over it.

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

I personally like the fact that all teams get a shot to win their way to Lincoln. However, I haven't really looked at the past history and looked to see if those near .500 teams that occasionally get there would have made the 16 or 32 team cut. The thing I have noticed with basketball is that a single early season (or late season for that matter) injury to a single player can really effect that team's record and therefore opportunity to possibly get to the State tournament. Football season hangover is another thing that can really hurt a basketball team early in the season.

I like the idea of assigning the districts late in the season. I know that it effects travel logistics and whatnot, but I like it. Additionally, in this format, I believe there should be 8 districts and no wildcards. I would just really like to see a situation in which the best 8 teams get to Lincoln. Plain and simple.

Either way, I won't lose any sleep over it.

Why not seed 1 to 32 play at neutral sites and be done with it, NO one under the 32 team cut will be above 500 and if so then try scheduling someone it will help

 

[HighPlainsCoach]

And this is our new liberal love all poor me get ribbon for showing up world has produced SAD. SEED it 1 to 31 and you still can win in Just awards the better teams as it should

You aren't serious, are you? You honestly think that "here's your cards, play them as well as you are able", is LIBERAL??? Friend, what really reeks of leftism is to inconvenience EVERY school, EVERY player, EVERY family just for the sake of some sort of perceived injustice. All to please the 1 or 2 schools who only lost to high caliber teams? So they can go to Lincoln to lose to similar teams? That's crazy. You know what else? The same team that has beaten your team 2-3 times and is a legit title contender? They are STILL there. Disrupting everyone just so a few parents aren't butt-hurt and one team can get their first round loser T shirts is PERFECT liberalism. Anything talking about "fairness" usually is. I have ZERO problem that the Hartington CC and Pierce girls are going to Lincoln despite neither being above the 16 team cut line. Every single NCAA championship except D1 Mens and Football uses Geography, and the Men's USED to, until massive TV deals made it possible not to. Not using geography in HS sports, expecially in a sprawling state like ours boggles the mind, and calls into play why we even have sports in our schools. Playing sub-Districts and Districts as close to home as possible is better for students, schools, families. That is common sense. And ruining that and dragging kids are over the state is....something else. And for MAYBE one team? Anybody that has a reasonable chance of winning it is already there.

 

[runningback43]

I am pretty sure that O'Neill deserves to be at the boys state basketball tournament over Ogallala.

 

[HighPlainsCoach]

Maybe. Again, if Albion wins C1 you'll have a point. But a 16 point loss to a team that wasn't in the Top16 starting post-season, and two losses to C2's doesn't build much sympathy from me. About as lackluster as 20 wins can be, it looks like. I'm sorry they didn't get their 1st round loser shirts. Now Ogallala does. Meh. Look at this way, at least in 20 years they can all say "we shoulda..." and not ended with a 25 point loss to Wahoo. In the meantime they weren't hauled all over the state missing class time. Silver linings.

 

[just_average32]

Maybe. Again, if Albion wins C1 you'll have a point. But a 16 point loss to a team that wasn't in the Top16 starting post-season, and two losses to C2's doesn't build much sympathy from me. About as lackluster as 20 wins can be, it looks like. I'm sorry they didn't get their 1st round loser shirts. Now Ogallala does. Meh. Look at this way, at least in 20 years they can all say "we shoulda..." and not ended with a 25 point loss to Wahoo. In the meantime they weren't hauled all over the state missing class time. Silver linings.

If we have 10 sub-district champions by geography, along with 6 wild cards, seed them 1-16 in a sub-state neutral site game played on a Saturday, and the 8 winners go to state and re-seed them there. Are you okay with that?

 

[just_average32]

If we have 10 sub-district champions by geography, along with 6 wild cards, seed them 1-16 in a sub-state neutral site game played on a Saturday, and the 8 winners go to state and re-seed them there. Are you okay with that?

I can not be held responsible for the production of "sub-state" loser t-shirts, but it seems like there's a market for it I'm sure

 

[sportsjunkie2030]

This isn't about Little Jimmy getting a state t-shirt. This is about improving the quality of competition in Lincoln, and if you're against that, well then you're just ignorant. Please do try to tell me how you'd rather watch Wahoo destroy Ogallala than watch Wahoo vs. a way more competitive team.

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

You aren't serious, are you? You honestly think that "here's your cards, play them as well as you are able", is LIBERAL??? Friend, what really reeks of leftism is to inconvenience EVERY school, EVERY player, EVERY family just for the sake of some sort of perceived injustice. All to please the 1 or 2 schools who only lost to high caliber teams? So they can go to Lincoln to lose to similar teams? That's crazy. You know what else? The same team that has beaten your team 2-3 times and is a legit title contender? They are STILL there. Disrupting everyone just so a few parents aren't butt-hurt and one team can get their first round loser T shirts is PERFECT liberalism. Anything talking about "fairness" usually is. I have ZERO problem that the Hartington CC and Pierce girls are going to Lincoln despite neither being above the 16 team cut line. Every single NCAA championship except D1 Mens and Football uses Geography, and the Men's USED to, until massive TV deals made it possible not to. Not using geography in HS sports, expecially in a sprawling state like ours boggles the mind, and calls into play why we even have sports in our schools. Playing sub-Districts and Districts as close to home as possible is better for students, schools, families. That is common sense. And ruining that and dragging kids are over the state is....something else. And for MAYBE one team? Anybody that has a reasonable chance of winning it is already there.

Why not seed 1 to 32 play at neutral sites and be done with it, NO one under the 32 team cut will be above 500 and if so then try scheduling someone it will help

 

[sportsjunkie2030]

Why not seed 1 to 32 play at neutral sites and be done with it, NO one under the 32 team cut will be above 500 and if so then try scheduling someone it will help

I agree 100% that change is needed!

 

[runningback43]

Ogallala does not deserve to be in Lincoln. If it wasn't for geography they wouldn't be. We don't use geography in football in class C-1 or C-2 why can't we throw out geography for the state boys basketball tournament?

 

[wsc-oline]

I don’t understand everyone’s hatred for t-shirts....

 

[SPbObRT]

T shirts make money. that is a simple answer.

 

[highschoolfootballnut]

I don’t understand everyone’s hatred for t-shirts....

 

[HighPlainsCoach]

If we have 10 sub-district champions by geography, along with 6 wild cards, seed them 1-16 in a sub-state neutral site game played on a Saturday, and the 8 winners go to state and re-seed them there. Are you okay with that?

Like Class C volleyball? LOL. At the risk of REALLY being a "get off my yard" type, I thought THAT was the dumbest idea since since the 7 game regular season in football a few years back. Even with that compromise, to me anyway, you are still burdening families for no appreciable benefit. Understand where half way from Mitchell to Fort Calhoun is. Or Chadron to Falls City. Or Benkleman to Lyons. If anything, and I have zero problems with the current system (my kids have enough T shirts), I'd rather see sub Districts reduced from 12 to 10 and add a thrid wildcard. But even that seems incredibly goofy.